PROPECIAHELP: Persistent Finasteride Propecia Proscar side effects info & discussion forum

0) Where are you from (country)? New Zealand

1) How did you find this forum Google

2) What is your current age, height, weight?
26, 74 kg, 6 feet

(3) Do you excercise regularly? If so, what type of excercise?

Little

4) What type of diet do you eat (vegetarian, meat eater, raw, fast-food/organic healthy)?

Healthy balanced diet, little sugar.

5) Why did you take Finasteride (hair loss, BPH, other)?
prevent hair loss.

6) For how long did you take Finasteride (weeks/months/years)?

4 months.

7) How old were you, and WHEN (date) did you start Finasteride?

19, Janurary 2004.

8) How old were you when you quit, and WHEN (date) did you quit?

19, April-May 2004.

9) How did you quit (cold turkey or taper off)?
Cold turkey.

10) What type of Finasteride did you use – Propecia, Proscar, Fincar or other generic?
Propecia.

11) What dose did you take (eg. 1 mg/day, 1 mg every other day etc.)?
1mg per day.

12) How long into your use of Finasteride did you notice the onset of side effects?
from the frist pill - immediatly.

13) What side effects did you experience while on the drug that have yet to resolve since discontinuation?

Put an X beside all that apply:

Sexual
[x ] Loss of Libido / Sex Drive
[ x] Erectile Dysfunction
[ x] Complete Impotence
[ x] Loss of Morning Erections
[ x] Loss of Spontaneous Erections
[ x] Loss of Nocturnal Erections
[ x] Watery Ejaculate
[ x] Reduced Ejaculate
[ ] Inability to Ejaculate / Orgasm
[x ] Reduced Sperm Count / Motility

Mental
[ x] Emotional Blunting / Emotionally Flat
[ x] Difficulty Focusing / Concentrating
[ x] Confusion
[x ] Memory Loss / Forgetfullness
[ x] Stumbling over Words / Losing Train of Thought
[ x] Slurring of Speech
[ x] Lack of Motivation / Feeling Passive / Complacency
[ x] Extreme Anxiety / Panic Attacks
[ x] Depression / Melancholy

Physical
[x ] Penile Tissue Changes (narrowing, shrinkage, wrinkled)
[ x] Penis curvature / rotation on axis (the frist 2 years, this went away)
[ x] Testicular Pain
[x ] Testicular Shrinkage / Loss of Fullness
[ x] Genital numbness / sensitivity decrease
[ x] Weight Gain
[x ] Gynecomastia (male breasts)
[ ] Muscle Wastage
[ x] Muscle Weakness
[ x] Joint Pain
[ ] Dry / Dark Circles under eyes

Misc
[ ] Prostate pain
[ ] Persistent Fatigue / Exhaustion
[ ] Stomach Pains / Digestion Problems
[ ] Constipation / "Poo Pellets"
[ ] Vision - Acuity Decrease / Blurriness
[x ] Increased hair loss
[ ] Frequent urination
[x ] Lowered body temperature

[ ] Other (please explain)

Bleeding of penis.

14) What (if any) treatments have you undertaken to recover from your side effects since discontinuation of the drug?

pregenolone + T3 + T4 + Clomid.

15) If you have pre or post-Finasteride bloodtests, what hormonal changes have you encountered since discontinuing the drug (pls post your test results in the "Blood Tests" section and link to them in your post)?

16) Anything not listed in the above questions you'd like to share about your experience with Finasteride?

17) Tell us your story, in your own words, about your Finasteride usage and side effects experienced while on/off the drug.

I took this drug when I was 19. I had a very fast metabolism at that stage. From the first pill I went from feeling like a horny teenager to an old man. My metabolism slowed dramatically. I was a mess both emotionally and psycically. I suspected all along that if propecia shrinks the prostate, then this is the cause of our symptoms.

From 2004-2009 I did nothing with minimal improvements. I took the usual vitamens all of us have taken on here - we all know these dont really help.

These past six years Ive been reaserching our problem, both on this forum and Dr Crisler's 'all things' male forum. I suspected that our sexual problems are similar to what old men suffer (ie those in their 80's).

A couple of years ago I read a thread by Chillen on all things male about hormone optimisation and maintaing optimal testostrone levels. He seemed to think pfs symptoms could be resolved by upregulating our metabolims. He personally experimented with drugs that optimised his homone levels based on how he felt. He advocates the following:

Start with:
(1) pregenonline cream, then
(2) T3.....then
(3) T4.
Clomid can be used too. I kept the doses of these drugs small (eg clomid 12.5 mg per day per Dr Crisler).

When I did a cycle of these drugs, I noticed my metabolism did in fact increase a little - a good sign. I then took a few months off and then repeated the same cycle. I've been doing cycles on and off for the past 18 months - experimenting based on how I felt. The most sucessful drug helping my symptoms has been T3.

The past month after using T3 and stopping, I noticed my prostate started to grow back to what it was and I could feel my adrogens working again. Now they are firing on all cylenders. The only drug Im on at the moment is clomid at 12.5mg. I figured that if my androgens and prostate are now functioning my body will now respond to a PCT much better like steriod users. This has proved correct. Im now very calm and relaxed and socially people (especially woman) can tell. I can smell my own testostorne scent...lol. My testicles are large again and sit nomally around my prostate.

Basically I can have sex and be ready to go almost immediatly. Life is good and exciting again

Questions are welcome,

Cheers,

_________________
CGJ

Wow man very nice, glad for you.

I cycled T3 for just a month and saw some improvements. Mainly I got morning erections back and my mood is a little better. I will stop short of calling this a cure but it definitely seems to be a piece of the puzzle at least for some of us.

What did your cycles look like dosage wise?

_________________
http://www.change.org/petitions/united- ... cial-agent

Small doses - Dont over do the drugs. I was using like 12.5mcg of T3 a day. Remember dose according to how you feel.

_________________
CGJ

Thanks for posting CGJ. Could you please outline your cycles of preg, T3, T4, and clomid according to dosage along a timeline? Glad to hear you're having some luck managing your symptoms.

Please keep us updated.

12.5mcg T3 per day, 12.5 clomid per day, pregnenlone cream (just would wipe on my body)

I cant give you any structure to when I took these drugs, other than that I would cycle them randomly when I felt bad sexually and emotionally symptoms wise.

Things to note in my favour.

I was young when I took it (19)
It wasnt until 7 years until a break though (26).

I went to a doctor in NZ and explained the PFS problem. They dont know shit, so i decided to reaserch and experiment on myself safely. (ie low doses)

_________________
CGJ

Note also my bleeding of the penis. Did any of you guys suffer this? This happened when I was still on the drug in 2004.

_________________
CGJ

Not to sound arrogant - but I think this protocal can help everyone on here, at least those like me who got fucked up from the very first pill.

_________________
CGJ

Actually you may be right. I have quite abit of T3 left on hand, and some clomid. I don't have the preg. but I think I will work up a little lite cycle plan for it tommarrow and continue with it for a few months.

_________________
http://www.change.org/petitions/united- ... cial-agent

I used T3 and HydroCortisone (HydroCortisone in exchange for Preg.) which made me go from complete zombie to feeling really good (except sexually). I only did one cycle though so maybe I should do some more.

When you took Clomid, did you take it every single day, or only daily during the cycles with T3 and Preg?


Happy that you are feeling good again!

cgj1 said he got a lot of PMs and suggested that everyone who PMed him post there messages and responses on this board to help everyone. Here are mine.

Dgreene:
Hey do you want to start a thread so people could ask you questions?

My question is:

Cgj1, if your 100% recovered why would you want to order the herbs though. After this don't you want to refrain from putting anything in your body?

Also, I remember PMing you a few months back and you said you were 70-80%. Can you clarify how you progressed from 70-80% to 100%? Slow and gradual? Quick? Were you just cycling T3?

I have my thyroid tested and everything is within range, so I don't know if I will be able to (or even if I should) try thyroid medication.

cgj1:

Yeah heaps of guys have pm'd me. So maybe you can get them to post my answers.

the 70-80% was more like 30%. The massive improvement for me in the past month is that my prostate has grown back enabling my androgens to fire on all cylinders. My testicles have grown back and sit around my prostate normally. They're huge now.

Improvements come in stages, which is determined by your metabolism ramping up.

Cheers,

Doesn't sound arrogant at all. I tried a T3 cycle and it didn't do too much for me but I didn't take it with clomid at the same time. Will mention it to my docs. Much thanks for takign the time to complete your member story.

Can I ask, to what degree did you have penile shrinkage and how has that recovered? Are you back to pre-Fin size? I'd pretty much given up on the idea of that ever being normal again. Any treatment that you noticed helped this side? A few of us here had an overnight extreme penile shrinkage event which is difficult to imagine ever correcting back to pre-Fin.

Why have you only posted elsewhere that finasteride left you with brittle diffuse hairloss?


Why have you not mentioned that you where diagnosed hypothyroid and prescribed T3 by your doctor?

I got fucked at the first pill. However, pregnenolone+clomid+thyroid hormones did not work too well for me. The results was a dramatic increase of cortisol. This might have happened because my body is in a high inflammatory state. Possibly, this hormonal protocol helps only once you fix the cause of the inflammatory state.

However, I agree with you -- this protocol can help everyone. Pregnenolone and thyroid is what has kept me alive and energetic in the past year.

_________________
My story: viewtopic.php?t=3556
My blood tests: viewtopic.php?p=19897#19897

Okay, so I have been reading this forum for some time now, and T3 seems to have BY FAR the best track record in terms of making people feel better. Or am I mistaken?

I would say you're mistaken. It didn't work for me. The problem IMO is that the Thyroid issue is more likely a side effect of a larger problem. If the Thyriod is the issue how do you explain the other problems that most of us have. If you really want to piece the puzzle together better get the tests done that venceremos had done. Also get your white and red blood cell counts tested.

I agree that thyroid is a symptom of the underlying condition, but it seems to be responsible for a great many of the side effects. I plan on getting the tests vece recommends.

I have had my white blood cell count checked three times now, and all three times I was below range. Why did you suggest I get them checked, and does this agree with the theory being developed?

The underlying problem is that the drug shrunk our prostate. The way I see it is that all our problems, thryoid, prostate, lack of androgens working etc are interconnected. Im sure these problems are downstream from our prostate shrinking. In other words, get your prostate back to its normal size and these are conditions will be fixed. (based on my observation of my body changing during my recovery).



Cheers.

_________________
CGJ

Why are your posts so aggressive Oscar? I said I was hypothyroid. This is the first time I have filled out my story since 2004. I have provided everybody with a list of my symptoms, treatment and recovery in one concise post. Your arrogance is not justified. Watch your tone. Im trying to help you.

_________________
CGJ

Forgot to mention, I took two pills of Indomethacin (HDCA inhibitor) two weeks ago. This may have accelerated things (improved my prostate) even further.

_________________
CGJ

Let's try not to hastly attribute beneficial effects of meds to supposed "secondary" properties.

Being an NSAID it is obviously antiinflammatory, while not being as widely immunosuppressant as corticoids=antiinflammatory appropriate for infection-induced inflammations.
I have not been able to find any info about it being an HDACi (just studies where its being used in combination with the HDACi butyrate, a well known HDACi, with the goal of tumor suppression)
I REALLY dont want to be a smartass, but where did you get the info that it was an HDACi from? Im not saying that its not, I havent looked hard enough, but looking for it quickly, it doesnt seem to be the case.
I just want to be sure you didnt fall victim to the same "hurried research" trap that our fellow 2nd amendment fell into.